Appendix
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Time to install
Aakash: 5 months (2022)
After upgrading our main panel, it took 121 days from our call to Tesla until Alameda Municipal Power (AMP) approved our solar panels.
Lessons learned:
- There was no communication after the installation. You won't know their progress unless you call.
- No payment is due until inspection is complete and powered on.
| Day | Date | Step |
|---|---|---|
| 1 | May 23 | Went to TeslaGoSolar.com/contact for a free quote. I reviewed and accepted payment terms. Paid $250 via Credit Card. Had to redo the whole process with a different email ID as I forgot to use my friend's referral code. This was an important step to avoid needing to redo succeeding steps. |
| 5 | May 27 | Tesla added documents to sign, and made a solar design (from satellite photos) and was waiting for me to accept the design. I highly recommend you review your roof at Project Sunroof to get the best possible design alterations, if needed. I had to change the design, as I did not like the one they prepared where the panels were visible from the street and did not give me any real advantage of sun ray angles. Submitted for Design Change the same day. |
| 27 | Jun 10 | Design change accepted. Site review and visit scheduled. Was setup for 22 days after design acceptance date. |
| 39 | Jun 27 | Site Visit took photos of our roof and garage and offered no suggestions. Just asked me if I would have an electric car in the future. |
| 45 | Jul 5 | Tesla emailed that they need to add $5,500 to the total cost for doing a main panel upgrade since the existing one is not suitable for installation, was very old, and the company that made it went out of business. I declined Tesla’s quote since it was higher than a local licensed electrician, and he would do it with full permits faster than Tesla. Tesla agreed to take it off the project list if I am able to submit the passed permit after the Main Panel upgrade. |
| 60 | Jul 20 | Main panel upgrade completed, filed for inspection. |
| 81 | Aug 10 | Inspection of the Main Panel completed. Sent images to Tesla for all documentation and photos of the installation. |
| 89 | Aug 18 | Tesla accepted the upgrade and filed it for Installation. |
| 94 | Aug 23 | Tesla emailed: they are working to obtain permits needed for installation. Utility company OK to install is pending despite receiving all the approvals. |
| 105 | Sep 3 | Tesla emailed that they have pending cases on our job to move it forward. in the meantime please log into the Tesla account to take a look at the pending document in your account. |
| 114 | Sep 12 | Tesla received the permits and that installation will start Sept 19 :-) FINALLY |
| 121 | Sep 19 | Tesla Contractor installed our Powerwall. (driveway needs to be completely clear) Tesla Contractor installed our solar panels and connected the system. They used the most expensive quad 2 pole 50-20 breakers, as the space in the Tesla Gateway breaker is limited and can't accommodate all the breakers from the New main Panel. No power or WiFi for 1 hour, then they showed us the basics on the app. Tesla Contractor finished the last bit of wiring; solar panels working. They painted the conduits to match the roof color and the exterior wall color. I had to buy my own paint for that. |
| 127 | Oct 25 | Tesla updated the status on the Account that Inspection is scheduled and Inspector will call. No calls or text followed this. I was unsure when the inspection was scheduled. A few hours later the status on the Account shows that Inspection is scheduled for 2 days later. It Oct 27 (unsure what time) |
| 129 | Oct 27 | Alameda City inspected (10 min) and signed inspection that AMP signed. I emailed photos of that to AMP for them to process (3-5 biz days). |
| 144 | Nov 11 | After no updates to my account, I called up Tesla and they told me that payment is overdue. They were sending me text messages to check the account, but the account status was stuck in “Inspection Scheduled” status. No attempts were made by Tesla to rectify the status. I still went ahead and made the full $40,000 payment (less initial deposit) via Credit Card. The link(s) had to be given by Tesla’s Billing department after calling them. You can use multiple credit cards. Tesla requested $2,000 Down Payment; I paid; Tesla will notify when processed. |
| 154 | Nov 21 | Tesla sent the Full Payment Receipt. However, the text messages of "Pending dues" still kept coming daily. |
| 184 | Dec 21 | Sent a snarky email with legal verbiage to Tesla reminding them that it has been more than 4 weeks since the full payment and I am yet to receive the PTO filing. They simply say that it was the failure of the automation they have in the system that the file was not picked up for processing post payment. A bunch of bad excuses. |
| 190 | Dec 27 | AMP approved connection to the grid and Activated our system (Powered On) |
Klages: 4 months (2021)
After upgrading our main panel and roof shingles, it took 190 days from our call to Tesla until Alameda Municipal Power (AMP) approved our solar panels.
Lessons learned:
- After purchasing, we just waited 3 weeks for a response; but calling would have shorted that wait.
- After the Site Visit and Installation dates were set, we called daily for earlier days and got them.
- Request your Solar Plans. We wasted 1 week because we didn't know they were waiting for us.
- Make sure you have an Emergency E-Stop button installed before inspection to avoid wasting time.
- If an inspector is late, call your City Permit Dept. Our inspection was canceled by an unknown contractor who mistakenly gave our project number instead of their client’s. Inspectors are very organized and prompt.
- Alameda Power will automatically put you in ERG rates. For details, see Rider-ERG-Effective-2022-7-1.
| Day | Date | Step |
|---|---|---|
| 1 | Sep 1 | Went to TeslaGoSolar.com/contact for a free quote. Tesla added documents to sign, made a solar design from satellite photos, and started filing permits. I accepted payment terms. |
| 27 | Sep 27 | Received email: Site Visit scheduled for Oct 9 (we called daily until we got an earlier one) |
| 39 | Oct 2 | Site Visit took photos of our roof and garage and offered suggestions. |
| 48 | Oct 11 | Tesla emailed: they are working to obtain permits needed for installation. |
| 58 | Oct 21 | Tesla emailed that they received the permits and that installation will start Dec 2. |
| 77 | Nov 9 | Tesla Contractor installed our Powerwall. (driveway needs to be clear) |
| 78 | Nov 10 | Tesla Contractor installed our solar panels and connected the system. No power or WiFi for 1 hour, then they showed us the basics on the app. |
| 79 | Nov 11 | Tesla Contractor finished wiring (solar panels working)--but didn't install an E-Stop. |
| 80 | Nov 12 | Tesla submitted "Approval to Power On" paperwork. |
| 92 | Nov 24 | Tesla emailed me that an inspector would call me. |
| 96 | Nov 28 | Tesla inspector called me to set up an appointment to inspect on Dec 9. |
| 107 | Dec 9 | Tesla inspector came and said we need an E-Stop (Emergency Stop button) installed first. |
| 113 | Dec 15 | Tesla installed E-Stop; AMP inspected & signed our panel system. (10 min) Contractor called City Hall Permit Dept; final inspection 12/20 9-12:00. |
| 118 | Dec 20 | Alameda City inspected (10 min) & signed inspection that AMP signed. I emailed photos of that to AMP for them to process (3-5 business days). |
| 119 | Dec 21 | Tesla requested $2,000 Down Payment; I paid; Tesla will notify when processed. |
| 121 | Dec 23 | AMP approved connection to the grid and Activated our system (Powered On; Permission-to-Operate) |
| 187 | Feb 27 | First monthly payment to Tesla. |
Breakdown of solar costs
We bought two Powerwall2s, and it's amazing how the Powerwall3 saves money and garage space.
| Item (with labor) | Powerwall2 | Powerwall3 |
|---|---|---|
| Battery | $11,000 | A Powerwall3 combines |
| Gateway | $ 7,000 | battery + gateway + inverter |
| Inverter | $ 2,000 | for a total of $11,000 |
| Wires + conduits | $ 1,500 | $ 1,500 |
| 24 Panels (9.6 kW) | $ 2,200 | $ 2,200 |
| ======= | ======= | |
| Total | $23,700 | $14,700 |
Lifestyle comparison
Over a 30-year period:
| Lifestyle | Vehicles | Furnace+AC | Water heater | Powerwalls | 30-year cost ($1,000) | Remarks |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Traditional | gas | gas | gas | 0 | $392 - $473 | |
| Hybrid | gas+elec | gas+elec | electric | 1 | $348 - $422 | ~20% from grid |
| Green | electric | electric | electric | 2 | $254 - $279 | ~2% from grid |
This 30-year cost comparison is based on:
- 2,000 sq.ft. home
- 2 cars per household
- solar panels and batteries are retail costs; each state has different rebates to lower those costs.
- 1 Powerwall2 is $10,500; 2 Powerwall2s are $17,000; 3 Powerwall2s are $23,500.
- KBB's 5-Year Cost To Own (x2 for 10yrs, x3 for 15yrs); Carmax prices; Depreciation values.
- 2013 Tesla Model S has driven 1,000,000 miles and recent EVs have much better technology.
What We Like:
- Now charging our cars at home during the afternoon instead of public stations at night.
- No longer concerned about the cost for our backyard lights, holiday lights, pond pumps, robot-vacuum, and living room lights turned on 24/7.
- Always having days of electricity during power outages.
Why be 100% self-powered
As more people buy solar panels, the huge profits utility companies have had for decades shrink; and they are fighting back by raising rates and lowering buy-back rates to solar owners. Some utilities don't even pay cash but instead give a 60% credit to reduce future electric bills!
The only way to avoid the UPC's monthly $50-70 tax on having solar panels is to install more panels and batteries in order to be completely self-reliant and cancel your electric service.
With our 8.5 kW, an $8-per-kW tax would equate to $68/mo, which is ridiculous when considering the facts:
- Our panels give an excess of 6,000 kWh annually: a monthly average of 500 kWh of excess energy.
- Our Utility company pays us $0.07 / kWh while charging $0.11 / kWh -- a profit of $0.04 per kWh.
- Tier 1 is 11.2 cents/kWh
- Tier 2 is 18.9 cents/kWh (69% more than Tier 1)
- Tier 3 is 28.6 cents/kWh (51% more than Tier 2)
- That's an average of 500 kWh/mo * $0.04 for an average of $20/mo that we give them.
And utility companies want to charge a tax on top of that free electricity (money) they receive every month--what??
Advantages of solar
| Advantage | What most people don't know |
|---|---|
| Lowers/removes electric bills | Bills will be $0/mo if you buy 2 Powerwall batteries to store excess energy. |
| Improves home value 1 | A 2024 SolarReviews study found that homes with solar panels sold for 6.8% more than homes without solar panels. |
| Sells home faster 1 | Homes with solar panels sell 20% faster. |
| Blackout protection | 1 battery lasts 1 rainy day (lasts all sunny days); 2 batteries last 3-4 rainy days. |
| Charge EV during the day | Solar reduces or eliminates your electric bill, so afternoon charging is free. |
1 The impact varies by location, system condition, and other factors.
Disadvantages of solar
| Disadvantage | What most people don't know |
|---|---|
| Doesn't work on every roof | Almost any roof can host panels, only wood and slate cannot host panels. |
| Can be expensive | Down payment is ~$2,000 and then ~$160/mo for 10 years, and no penalty for paying faster. |
| If your bill is less than $100/mo, then no need | Low bills currently don't need panels, but repeated drought years have lowered dam reservoirs, which many studies state will get worse, which will severely increase power prices within 1-3 years. Better to get panels before then. |
| Roof must be less than 10 years old | 50-year shingles cost nearly the same as 30-year shingles: $10-20k, which will pay for themselves in 7-10 years. Solar panels degrade about 25% by year 50. |
Heat pump vs. gas furnace
In recent years, heat pump technology has skyrocketed to be many times more efficient and cost much less than five years ago. There's even a heat pump for both air and water.
The following table is for a 2,000 sq.ft. home.
| Electric heat pump + AC | Gas furnace + AC | |
|---|---|---|
| Unit cost | $14,000 - $16,500 | $3,000 - $4,000 |
| Installation cost | $1,000 - $1,500 | $1,500 - $2,000 |
| Total cost | $15,000 - $18,000 | $4,500 - $6,000 |
| Fuel costs | More than gas Free with 10 kW solar panels | Less than electric |
| Lifespan | 20 - 30 years Don't have issues that gas has | 10 - 20 years Small particles build up; can cause failure & corrosion |
| Climate suited for | Mild | Very cold |
| Installation | Easier and safer than gas but heavy-duty wiring should be done by a pro | Complex and dangerous due to combustive element, CO2, and tools. Takes several days. Need to vent. |
| Maintenance | Easier than gas. No burner to clean or inspect; doesn't require a pro | Needs regular pro maintenance and inspection yearly to keep it safe |
| Noise level | Almost silent. Simple design; no moving parts, vents, or burners. | Much noisier than electric. Loud rushing sound during startup and burner ignites. |
| Safety | Safer than gas | Has combustible items |
| How they work In both, heated air is forced by a blower fan through the ductwork into the rooms. | Electric ignition receives a thermostat signal to activate electric heating elements inside the furnace. | Signal causes pilot light to ignite the main burner of the heat exchanger. Pilot light is a small flame always burning. Heat exchanger draws heat from the main burner to heat the air. |
Water heaters: elec. vs. gas
In recent years, electric water heater technology has skyrocketed to be many times more efficient and cost much less than five years ago. There's even a heat pump for both air and water.
The following table summarizes Bob Vila's article
| Electric tankless | Electric tank | Gas tank | |
|---|---|---|---|
| Unit cost | $489 for 40-gal 4.5 kW | $1500 for 50-gal 50k BTU | |
| Installation cost | Needs rewiring | $1400 | $800 |
| Total cost | $3000 | $1900 | $2300 |
| Fuel costs | More than gas Free with 10 kW solar panels | More than gas Free with 10 kW solar panels | Less than electric |
| Lifespan | 15 - 20 years | 10 - 15 years | 8 - 10 years |
| Input power | 4.5 kW | 4.5 kW | 30 - 180 kBTU |
| Panel breaker | 30 Amps | 30 Amps | 20 Amps |
| Wire (minimum) | 10-gauge | 10-gauge | 12-gauge |
| Heating element - Top (warm) - Bottom (cold) | Warms instantly | Warms faster than gas - set to 100 ºF - set to 90 ºF | Warms slower than electric - set to 150 ºF - set to 150 ºF |
Notes:
- For the electric water heater, use a licensed electrician who has installed dozens before with new parts. Our contractor added a used 20-amp breaker that failed after 2 months. After 7 days of no hot water, we found someone who fixed it within an hour.
- To prevent the electric water heater turning on every 2-3 hours, lower the settings of the Heating Elements.
- Warm water rises to the top of the tank while colder water falls to the bottom of the tank.
- Electric heaters heat quickly, so setting the top element to 110 ℉ is warm enough.
- No need to heat the bottom of the tank, so setting the bottom element to 90 ℉ is warm enough.
- Regardless of climate, a silver/reflective water heater blanket is a very cheap way to save 10-16%.
East Bay Green@Home Tour
Solar panels
| How does the weather affect solar panel efficiency? - Clouds reduce production by 10-60% - Rain reduces production by 50-80% - Fog reduces production by 70-90% How many solar panels do I need? - (highest electric bill kWh * 12 months) / (400w panels) - About 20 to 26 (400-watt) panels for a 1400 sq.ft. home |  |
My roof isn't flat or east-west facing, is that ok?
- That's fine. South is ideal, East/West is good, North is so-so but still useful.
- Flat is best in summers due to high sun; almost vertical is best in winters due to low sun.
Should I fix/replace the roof while considering solar panels? Should it be more reflective?
- Yes, roofs last 30-40 years; solar panels last 50+ years.
- It costs about $8,000 to remove and reinstall panels when updating your roof.
- A lighter color roof reflects heat which keeps the solar panels cooler and more efficient.
Are moveable solar panels effective/worth it?
- Yes, and ground-mount panels are usually more effective than rooftop.
- If you have space in your backyard, ground-mounted solar panels are better because:
- No need to pay for removal/reinstallation when fixing/upgrading your roof
- Easier to wash/rinse/clean and maintain
- Dual-Axis Tracking panels are even more effective as the panels follow the sun during the day and seasons.
How many amps do I need? Or is it Volts?
- Ideally, your main panel should be 200 amps, no smaller than 150 amps (AMP has $1,500 rebate)
Do I need a 240 Volt system?
- No, solar panels do not require a 240-volt system to function. They draw what your home demands
- Your solar inverter automatically synchronizes with the grid to supply both 120V and 240V.
How does the energy buyback system work?
- AMP gives credit for the excess kWh your system gives to the grid, which you'll use in winter.
- Other electric companies pay cash for excess but at a much lower rate than they sell electricity.
What happens when the power goes out?
- If you don't have a battery, you immediately lose all power to your house--for safety.
- If you do have a battery, your power is continuous, and you won't know there's an outage.
HVAC system
How does an HVAC System work? How does it do both heating and cooling?
- (setting) A thermostat is used to regulate temperature.
- (cooling) A refrigerant is circulated between an outdoor unit and an indoor coil. The indoor coil absorbs heat from the air inside your home which the refrigerant carries outside.
- (heating) Heat Pumps operate like a reverse air conditioner. In the winter, it pulls residual heat energy from the cold outdoor air and transfers it inside.
- (filtering) The system forces air through your home, passing through filters that capture dust, allergens, and pollutants.
Will the room I put the HVAC system in get super hot/cold?
- No. The heat pump is outside (usually backyard), and the air handler is in the attic.
Battery
Can you survive without a battery in an outage?
- No, panels turn off during an outage for safety, so you need a battery to power your home when there's no sun.
Do you need a second battery?
- No. Tesla's Powerwall3 supplies 11 kW of power, which can run all electric appliances simultaneously.
- A second battery is needed for extended outages; 2024 EVs and newer can be your 2nd battery.
Why would one need a backup battery?
- When there's little or no sun: evenings, nights, winters, cloudy/rainy/foggy days, outages, or blackouts.
Electric Vehicles (EVs)
Do car chargers come with inverters?
- Not needed since the inverter responsible for charging the battery is built inside the EV itself.
Do fast chargers have more wear and tear on EV batteries than home chargers?
- Very slightly. About 1-2% more than home chargers.
Do EVs put more pressure or wear-and-tear on tires?
- Yes. Due to the batteries, EVs weigh 20-30% more than equivalent ICE vehicles. ($800-1600 vs $400-1200)
- EVs cost 40-50% less to maintain/repair over their lifetime compared to ICE vehicles. ($2000-4600 vs $9200-15000)
Do EVs have as many lifetime carbon emissions as ICE vehicles?
- No, EVs produce 50-70% fewer lifetime greenhouse gas emissions than ICE vehicles.
General
How do I know my home's total amperage?
- Open your electrical panel and find the main breaker switch (usually at the very top or bottom).
- The amperage rating (e.g., 100, 150, 200) is printed right on the switch or on a label next to it.
What happens during a power surge?
- Nothing should happen, but a surge protector on expensive computers and appliances is suggested.
Electrify order
It's expensive to convert everything to electric, what's the cheapest order it can be done?
-
EV -- which you can fully charge for $0 at your office or $10-15 overnight at home or $15-20 at public chargers.
- Chevy Bolt is $300/mo to lease for 3 years; can lease longer; can buy it very discounted at lease end.
- Important: Sell your ICE vehicle while there is still demand; it will be tough to sell ICE vehicles in a few years.
-
Electric main panel upgrade to 200 Amps is about $3,000 - $4,000 (AMP has $1,500 rebate)
-
Replace all gas-powered appliances in the order that fits your budget. (Heat pump makes the biggest difference)
Item Cost Federal tax credit AMP rebate PG&E rebate Heat pump + AC $18,000 $2,000 $1,500 0% financing Water heater $400 - $560 30% up to $2,000 Up to $1,500 0% financing Washer + dryer $700 - $2,500 -- $400 0% financing Stove + oven $600 - $2,000 $4,000 with panel upgrade
$840 via HOMES program$300 for cooktop
$500 for range0% financing 1 kW battery $400 - $600 $150 - $200 via SGIP program -- $300 -
(for free) PG&E removes your gas meter and pours new concrete, which is important for solar system placement
-
Solar panels
- 9.6 kW (24 Tesla panels) + one Powerwall3 costs about $28,000 after rebates.
- You can finance with a very low APR and pay about $270/mo; no penalty for paying off early.
- You will break even in 6 - 8 years and then have free electricity for 50+ years.
- Get a solar panel quote after having your January (highest) electric bill to multiply by 12 for a proper size.
Our solar panel system
- Our home is 1370 sq.ft. at an elevation of 10 feet, about 2 miles from the bay.
- We have 20 Tesla 420w panels (8.5 kW, 200 Amp)
- Utility bills before install ranged from $140/mo to $280/mo.
Note to solar vendors
The following gripes are what we and friends have experienced with various solar vendors, so we hope all solar vendors keep these in mind.
| Gripe | Description |
|---|---|
| Improve communication | Don't make customers chase you down, and don't ignore customers trying to reach you. |
| Explain the plans | After the site visit, show and explain the plans along with anything that needs to be done. Be clear if you're waiting for the customer to move shelves or send photos. |
| Explain the restrictions | When any aspect of your designed system doesn't follow a typical design (for example, putting the E-Stop on the front garage wall instead of the side yard), then explain why you did that and allow the customer to fix or adjust whatever is needed to achieve the typical design. Nobody told us anything about the law requiring 3 feet on both sides of our gas meter and that it necessitates putting the huge, ugly E-Stop switches on the front of our garage (inviting any passerby to shutdown our solar) instead of installing those on the side yard as you display in your marketing materials. Warning us about this would have allowed us to convert our furnace to electric and have the gas meter removed which would allow proper installation on the side yard. |
| Explain the financing option | We were told only the total cost of our panels before installation; if we had been told the affordable monthly amount, then we would have ordered more panels and a 2nd Powerwall and be happier. |
| Explain why a 2nd battery is better | We would've bought two Powerwalls had we been told: - The electric appliances we plan to use will draw way more than 1 Powerwall's max. - A single Powerwall is nowhere near enough to remove all electric bills. - A 2nd Powerwall is needed to store the daily excess between May and Aug. - A 2nd Powerwall is needed on all non-sunny days. |
| Allow customers to report bugs | Have a mechanism for solar panel customers to give feedback and suggestions from their own experience; and at the very least, allow current customers a quick and easy way to report bugs to reduce other customer complaints and improve customer satisfaction with caring service. |
| Make it easy to reach a technician | Whenever there's a problem with the solar app or somewhere in the system, make it quick and easy for a technician to come out and see with their own eyes. |
| Be more clear about the panels | At no point did our salesperson or the site surveyor say anything about: - Our 50-year-old main panel was made by a company that went bankrupt decades ago. - That brand of panel is poor-quality and not the safest. - Our unsafe breakers were installed wrong. - How it'd be better if we upgrade both the Main Panel and Sub-panel before installation. |
| Plan for the future | We explained the electric upgrades and additions we will do and to size our system based on that; but two months after installation, a technician explained what the salesman should've explained: that solar companies are limited to install panels based on the home's annual kWh usage and that customers need to install those items for more than a month before designing a solar panel system in order to get an electric bill that includes all electric items that will be used. |